Mantua, MRC, Track

A Tale Involving Atlas Selectors and Mantua Turnouts versus Vintage American OO Locomotives

I wired my small layout (when I rebuilt the turnouts 15+ years ago) using vintage Atlas Selectors. I used two of them to control the blocks and to power the frogs of the turnouts at the same time (augmenting the contact provided at the points). They had been purchased years ago with some N scale trains at a garage sale (!), and were a good solution that allowed me to operate multiple trains and switch industries.

Part I: But eventually I noticed that the locomotives were slowing down

Over the years, week to week, mainly I run through trains on the loop. Over time I had accepted that locomotives slowed down in the curves of my layout. I figured it was something about pulling the weight of the train through, so I put it out of my mind. Physics! Still, when I started making the little videos that I post on Facebook and Instagram, it was an annoyance I noticed, that trains sped up and slowed down.

Then I was running a Nason gas-electric (with a big open frame motor) and I noticed that it sped up and slowed down in certain places that aligned exactly with the mainline blocks — and that it was not due to pulling a long train through the curves! And then a couple days later I was running the West Coast Southern NW-2 that I had recently rebuilt with a small can motor — and it did not slow down anywhere. It ran perfectly smoothly and would creep around the entire layout easily.

A round of testing

This led to a round of trying locomotives out. I feel fortunate to have quite a few nice locomotives, but it bothered me that not very many that would go around the layout without changing speed into and out of the mainline blocks. Vintage motors of most types were an issue, open frame motors, Athearn motors, etc. But the ones with small can motors were all good.

Eventually I figured out that the issue must be that I have power to two large mainline blocks (that encompass the curves) routed through those Atlas Selectors. Some areas of the layout are live all the time, directly connected to the power pack, and my theory was that those areas were getting more amps to the motors than will pass through the Atlas Selectors.

An aside: My power pack is great

My power pack puts out 5 amps! It is an MRC Control Master 20. It is now out of production but you can find them on eBay, it was marketed as a “High Power Train Controller.” It is well worth seeking out if you want to do some basic operation with your vintage OO models, most of those motors (especially Scale-Craft!) draw a lot of power. A more standard HO transformer won’t cut it with the vintage models. Also, this power pack has a higher voltage G scale setting, which is perfect for operating several models I have with the original 24-volt S-C DC motor.

A wiring modification solves the problem for all the Diesels

Testing the theory, I wired around the selectors for the mainline blocks and yes, everything runs the same speed around the layout. I will probably leave the fix like it is for now, as I can still switch the industries, but I should eventually upgrade at least one of the selectors to beefier SPDT switches. But at this point the Diesels all run great around the mainline!

Part II: The turnouts versus steam locomotives

Then there is another big issue with the turnouts. Backing up a few steps, I laid this track a long time ago. I was high school and early college when I hand laid most of this track. There was a point nearly 10 years ago when I reworked a corner to correct a radius issue (more here), and closer to 15 years ago I had reworked the turnouts for improved operation. The turnouts were rebuilt with vintage Mantua parts, which had the same general geometry as my original homemade turnouts. They are manually controlled and the frogs, as already mentioned, are wired to an Atlas Selector (plus the contact that the points make helps out the frogs, but you don’t want to rely on that).

I am very influenced by how models run. I build trains to run trains! The sad fact was that most of my steamers did not run that well on the layout, something about the point and frog setup does not agree with the long wheelbase and keeping steady current to the motor.

More testing: Just a few steamers ran well

All of the steamers 2-6-0 and bigger with current drawn from one rail on the locomotive and one rail on the tender just didn’t run well.

Curiously, found that the steamers that operated well were almost all from a small subset of what I have, in particular my S-C 0-6-0 and a 4-6-0 and a kitbashed 2-6-0. The common thread among these are they all have all power pickup from the tender wheels only, using the big S-C Universal motor connected to a modern rectifier. This is how Scale-Craft recommended they be set up, picking up power from the tender only, and they can run smooth all the way around the layout!

This engine ran the best

This 4-6-0 was the best of all the steamers. I rebuilt it a few years back — there was once an article on it on the site, but that was removed as the photo was used in the book. It was built by Pierre Bourassa. When it came to me, he had tried to update it with a small (too small) can motor on the drive. I converted it back to use an original S-C motor, with “the standard upgrade” to use Nason trucks with the bronze side frames on the tender. If you want to see the wiring, I wired it up just like Oreland 8 seen in this article.

This is good news too, as this size engine looks great on my curves, and I now have some extra inspiration to rebuild several more of these that have languished in boxes. I used to have several more operational versions of this model, such as the previously mentioned Oreland 8 and another 0-6-0 set up with this motor; it is high time to build a couple more of these. I have a 2-6-0 project that would be a perfect one to go to next.

Physics: even this engine slows down in the curves with a longish train

I was right though that a longer train does slow down things, even if when running light an engine will smoothly traverse the layout. It has been fun though to run this model with a train of Canadian road cars. All the models seen below were built by Pierre Bourassa.

More testing: working on the turnouts more helped a few more steamers run better.

I noticed that part of the problem was that larger steamers would “bounce” a bit in the turnouts. This caused an electrical interruption and a hesitation. I was able to help this somewhat by double checking around the frogs and guardrails with my NMRA OO/On3 standards gauge, which is the indispensable tool. With that work I now have five steamers that run well, including my Johann 2-8-2 which is a kick to see running on the layout.

Still though, there are basic issues with the Mantua turnout parts I used. In particular I think they notched the points too deeply into the stock rails. Someday I’ll give the turnouts another once over, and I may just need to rebuild them again to run more engines. I remember that Bill Chapin used components he harvested from Atlas HO switches to build his turnouts, and I may need to try that. And someday I’d love to have a layout with larger radius curves, but that is a few years down the road. I’m still glad to see the layout working better, I really like to see the trains rolling smoothly.